I am copying and pasting the email I received just minutes ago as I wrote my last post. It will be up temporarily, as it is an exact copy and I fear that if I leave it up for too long, I will get discovered. But I look forward to comments from my blogger friends before I take it back down.
This FB message was sent to me by NM:
(and this is it in it's entirety)
(THIS EMAIL HAS BEEN REMOVED TO PROTECT MY ANONYMITY. PLEASE NOTE THAT IT WAS A LONG, DRAWN OUT DESCRIPTION OF A HER LATEST BOUGHT OF MEDICAL PROBLEMS, FINANCIAL PROBLEMS, WHICH REALLY ARE NOT PROBLEMS AT ALL)
What the hell do I respond to THIS?
If you want to know if she is a narcissist or not, maybe you could try responding with some facts like, I feel like all your messages are completely talking about yourself and you don't even ask me how I'm doing and I feel like you're not respecting me or my time or whether I'm interested in the topic you're talking about or not.
ReplyDeleteIf she responds with something like, ME SELFISH? YOU'RE THE SELFISH WHORE, WHORE then she's narcissistic.
Or you could just not respond at all.
Good thoughts Lisa. But I have NO DOUBT she's a narcissist. This is not the first email like this (I get them several times a week). And facts I respond with are met with silence or she just ignores my response. It is just pure BAIT.
DeleteI agree Jessie, I think she is baiting you. But Lisa also brings up a good point: Narcs HATE it when you expose them. They hate it when you see what they are up to and worse, when you call them out on it. It would be interesting to see how she'd respond to you if you expressed your concern, but then followed that up with a comment about how inappropriate it is for her to be sharing most of this with you.
DeleteI mean, if you ignore it, but you still plan to maintain a relationship with her, then this is just one more think that will be swept under the rug. Not necessarily for YOU, but for her. And that's dangerous because she'll think she got away with it.
My answer is always the same for dealing with narcs. The less you deal with them, the better off you are (in terms of your emotional, physical, and mental well-being). But, if it's not a case where you are willing or able to go No Contact, then there are still ways of handling their manipulation tactics while still maintaining a relationship.
Yes, good point. I guess I forgot to mention that I have called her out in the past. I have told her how inappropriate and unfair she was being. The thing is, it never got me anyway. It started this game of chasing my tail. She'd always have some excuse. She is slippery. And then she'd turn it on me. And we would go round and round and round. It would wind up in these battles. And afterwards, she would use it against me and use it to win support from her flying monkeys. She most definitely hated it, but there was nothing I could do to make her see my point and it made things worse. So, I've learned just to acknowledge it in the simplest, most neutral responses I can. This is one of the areas she uses to target my weaknesses (compassion) and so I've learned I can't expose that part of me. It makes me too vulnerable.
DeleteShe's put you in a really sticky situation this time. She thinks it's already predetermined how you have to respond. I don't doubt she has a real problem and that she really is scared. But having to wear sunblock indoors is nonsense. Selling the convertible?? My heart bleeds. I can understand why this is up temporarily, it's a giveaway. I've had a bit of personal experience with the same problem and I don't wan't give myself away either so I'll email you. I hope you get loads of comments and advice on this.
ReplyDeleteThanks Dave, I look forward to hearing what you have to say.
Delete"I don't doubt she has a real problem and that she really is scared."
DeleteThat's interesting. I do doubt it. In my experience, narcs are generally always lying, or fabricating partial-truths to get what they want. Now, it could be that she is telling the truth, but if that's the case, then I doubt her INTENTION for telling Jessie. I think, it doesn't matter if she really is sick or not (except for the fact that an empathetic person never wants to hear that someone they love or care about is suffering) what she's really after is something from Jessie that Jessie is not in a position to give.
That's the difficult part with my mom. Everything she says has a ring of truth to it, or is built around facts. But she doctors it up with all this drama and projected realizations that it's hard to know what the actual truth is. I've seen her do this with stories about step-dad and NSis. It was one of those defining moments in our relationship, where I realized she had a really skewed sense of reality that always was built around some perceived slight. And I believe, in her head, she's convinced herself that she is correct in her recall.
DeleteAnd her intention is all about trying to get to me. I wrote this in a post below, but this her form of narcissistic rage. She's bored and pissed off no one is paying attention to her. And Estep-dad brushed her off. So, she's trying me know (funny, she never tries this shit with NSis). Plus, she's angry I didn't allow her to come rescue me and "help" me. She's mad that I haven't asked about her million appointments. She really has nothing better to do and has to create drama to feel important. She loves to say how no one gives a shit about her.
How about something like: "Oh, that's a shame about having to sell the car, but it sounds like staying indoors is the sensible thing to do. Keep me posted"
ReplyDeleteOr you could just ignore everything she said and respond with an email about how bad your colds have been.
It's unlikely that what she has is serious otherwise she would have left you a phone message saying: "I need to talk to you, please call me as soon as you can" instead of messaging you on FB.
I hope it helps. Kara
Thanks Kara. As I told Lisa above this is a typical email from her. I get them several times a week. This dermatologist crap has been going on for over a year...and then before that, I was pushing her to see the damn dermatologist. It's all just selfish b.s.
DeleteI have a few minutes in the wee early morning. I'm going to attempt to answer this before my little guy wakes up.
ReplyDeleteHugs,
Jonsi
DAMN IT!!!!!!!!!! My long answer was just fucking deleted.
ReplyDeleteJessie, I'm going to copy and paste this email and write you a private email during my kid's naptime.
Kids will be getting up soon. I'll try this again in email form. Damn it. damn it damn it.
Just in case I don't have enough time, I want to say right now: Breath. Take a step back. Ride your guilt, or whatever negative feeling you have and fight the urge to respond right away, right now, how your mother would want you to. Be honest with yourself. By doing so, you'll also be honest with your mother, even if you say nothing to her at all.
Okay I'm going to try to write an email. I had a super long answer so it might take awhile..\
Thanks Jonsi for taking the time. I know how hard it can be to fit things in between the little ones waking up and nap times (when I imagine you have lots of other things to do too!). Thanks so much!
DeleteI also had a fricking long post delete on me the other day. Enough to make me want to launch the computer across the room!
I know, that's probably happened to all of us bloggers. I usually feel like crying. I'm like, "Damn it! All those fantastic points I made. Gone! I won't be able to write it that well again!" It's super frustrating.
DeleteAnyway, I just emailed you my response. I hope it helps, even in some small way. I'm here if you need a friend.
Hugs,
Jonsi
oh and by the way....dotdotdotdot...and....dotdotdotdot....and also...dotdot dot dot dot dodtododtododoodtotododotododtotdodtodtoto...
ReplyDeleteAren't you just hanging on my every word? I mean, the suspense must be even greater than the words BETWEEN all that suspense.
Glad you caught that and see my point. Isn't it infuriating. Anymore, I just skip from one dotdotdot to the next. There are the real message anyway.
Delete*They, not there
DeleteIf this is typical for her, it makes me wonder what she's got up her sleeve for when you become super adept at handling her manipulations. It sounds like you're already working on not being manipulated anymore (as you had been as a child), so it really makes me wonder. If this is her normal "best behavior" what's it gonna look like when she starts to realize you're pulling away?
ReplyDeleteGosh. What an ugly person your mother is.
I know. I am a little fearful of that. It's been a little TOO quiet on the narco front. She's been taking my "absences" with a little too much grace. But, I hate to see this, for all her sneakiness and deception, she doesn't pick up on it from me all that much (I'm a bit too clever for her.) I think the worst came right after I became engaged. That's when the real pulling away started. And she was GOD AWFUL. She's mellowed a bit. But she has, really, only myself and my sister as narc supply...so she's bidding her time.
DeleteI want to thank you all for your support and advice. Your comments today opened my eyes up so much more than you could've realized. But not in the way I had expected. See, I was overwhelmed with how serious you all took NM. I was shocked that you all actually were concerned for her health and my feelings about that. Not because that's not how you (normal people) shouldn't have responded, but because it's been so long since I've fallen into her manipulative crap. I had forgotten how good she is at the pity game. But, let me assure you, this is all crap. While the "facts" of the email are undoubtedly true, the dramatics are just that. DRAMATICS. I have been receiving emails like this for YEARS. Almost every email I get from her contains drivel like this (if it's not about her, than someone else is in dire circumstances.) I realized how calloused (maybe healed?) I've become that it doesn't even bother me anymore. Makes me a bit sad that I'm so cynical that I don't even worry about her. What a horrible daughter I must be that this didn't even make me worry a bit. These emails from mom are usually met with eye-rolls from husband and I. I dutifully type a quick response and move on.
ReplyDeleteI think what I needed the advice on...well, maybe I didn't need any advice. I think I was annoyed with this email and I just felt like posting it as a way to explain my side of the story. Her words are better and describing her than any thing I could write. Her giant, run-on sentence pity party, describe the lonely, bored, old woman who has to concoct drama in order to make herself feel alive. And there is nothing more telling than when she states that Estep-father didn't give her the attention she wanted for this, so she's laying it on me. This is her form of narcissistic rage. She's angry at him that he doesn't take her serious. She's angry at me because I haven't asked about her appointments and I turned down her recent offer to come and "help me". But keep in mind, my friends, that this crap has been going on for over a year (the dermatology crap) and before that there was something else, and before that something else.
And as a side note about the damn car. The car is a sticking point with me. I was three weeks from my scheduled c-section when she texted asking that my husband drive her three-hours each way to pick it up. She'd been talking about this car, searching for it, for the last few months of my pregnancy in an effort to get the attention away from me. She said she was buying it because she was retiring soon, and SOB, she wouldn't be able to do things like that anymore. So, anyway, she texts and I tell her no. DH and I had plans. He had plans to help me with something as a gift for Mother's Day. She never asked if WE had plans. And beside that, we were three weeks away from our baby's birth and we had things to do. And on top of that, weekends were the only time that I got relief from my son. I stay at home with my kids, and being 9 months pregnant with a two year old is exhausting. I was in a lot of pain, and needed the rest and respite. Plus, I had had a serious complication with my first pregnancy and really shouldn't have been left alone (with a two year old) so close to my due date. But none of this entered her selfish head. She just expected me to "loan" her my husband like he was a shovel. She was so angry at me. But she paid me back in various sneaky ways. So, fuck the damn convertible. I don't care what she does with it.
Thanks again, friends. You really have opened my eyes. I welcome and appreciate anything else you have to say on the subject. THank you for all your support and for listening. It has made such a HUGE difference in my life.
Yay!
DeleteAnd there's a third option too, in addition to nothing and facts,
3. FUCK YOU OMG STOP FUCKING EMAILING ME.
This actually works. It was the only way to get my dad to stop calling and my exbf to stop harassing me and "trying to be my friend." Curtains came down and I was just like STFU YOU SLEAZEBALL I KNOW YOU'RE A SLEAZEBALL YOU THINK I'LL FALL FOR YOUR POOR ME I'M SO NICE CHARM? YOU'RE JUST A SLIMEBALL. I TOLD YOU TO STOP FUCKING TALKING TO ME. STOP FUCKING TALKING TO ME. With my dad, he was like, ring ring, I was like, WHAT? STOP CALLING ME. It shut them up.
Oh, Lisa, I SO LOVE YOU. I really would love to do that. I've fantasized about that. Unfortunately, I'm not ready for that. It would cut me off completely from lots of people I love.
DeleteAnd sometimes, I think, maybe that would just be running away. Now, don't get me wrong. I think NC is the best option for a lot of people. I think NC is the only way lots of people can protect themselves. It's just not my choice at this point (not that I don't reserve it for the future). I'm kind of a beginner at all this stuff. And at this point, I'm able to keep her at a safe distance. Like a pet tiger behind a cage. She's nice to look at and I can show her to my friends, but I don't fear her tearing my head off.
My "response" would be resounding SILENCE or "Oh."
ReplyDeleteWhat a damn drama queen. No doubt the dermatologist is doin' some "Fillin'" here and there. Wish my biggest "Health Care" problems were a couple of non-malignent moles and my autoimmune disease tests came back negative. What a self-centered bitch. Aging happens and ya roll with it. Or off yourself. Stop whining, sell your oh-so-special vehicle and pay your bills. It's just a mechanical thing that's "depreciating"/deteriorating at a faster rate than NM if possible. If you can't "afford" sunscreen, buy a Burka. You HAVE private insurance and some of these MDs will milk that to death.
How well I know. It was suggested to me while I was in my 40's that I entertain the idea of having my "Baby Basket" removed. I responded, "Are you referring to my uterus?" (Male) Gyno: "Ah, well yes!" Me: "Why would I want to do that? I'm not having any problems." Gyno (eagerly): "Well that way you'll never have to WORRY about having any!" Me: "Even after menopause, my uterus will still be sending out cytokines. Tell ya what, you have your prostate removed first and then YOU won't have any problems with benign hyperplasia which is a normal part of male aging. When you do THAT I'll consider removing my perfectly healthy uterus. See ya. Oh, and don't send me any kind of co-pay bill for this visit or I'll be contacting your licensing agency and the State Health department to inform them of the results and "recommendations" of my routine yearly gyno exam."
I'm back to Planned Parenthood. We don't have a bunch of choices here.
TW
TW
I've been voting silence, but if you feel you must respond, maybe something like: "That must be very scary for you."
ReplyDeleteAnd leave it at that.