I came across this on FB. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
“Not all toxic people are cruel and uncaring. Some of them love us dearly. Many of them have good intentions. Most are toxic to our being simply because their needs and way of existing in the world force us to compromise ourselves and our happiness. They aren’t inherently bad people, but they aren’t the right people for us. And as hard as it is, we have to let them go. Life is hard enough without being around people who bring you down, and as much as you care, you can’t destroy yourself for the sake of someone else. You have to make your wellbeing a priority. Whether that means breaking up with someone you care about, loving a family member from a distance, letting go of a friend, or removing yourself from a situation that feels painful — you have every right to leave and create a safer space for yourself.”
Daniell Koepke
My first question is - who posted this? I'm a consider the source kind of gal and if this was a narc posting this somewhere where you could see it, I think that'd have to be considered in it's evaluation.
ReplyDeleteAs for the content, I sometimes have a hard time digesting the idea that not all toxic people are cruel or uncaring. However, there have been a few cases where I've known (or known of) toxic people who were capable of love, but didn't have the interpersonal skills necessary for that to factor out the damage they did to others. My paternal grandmother was one such case, and there aren't too many others who come to mind.
The thing is that I don't think narcissists are capable of love or empathy and therefore, I think they are always cruel and uncaring. So I don't think they fit the bill here. If you're dealing with a narcissist, it's my thought that he/she IS toxic and more than likely cruel and uncaring as a result.
It wasn't posted by a narc. As far as I can tell, she's not a narc. However, this person is a very damaged person who came from a really fucked up FOO. She is often spouting off on FB about how people have hurt her. And she often talks about how she "cares" too much. I think she is one of those people who is a bit emotionally unstable and takes things WAY to personally and gets WAY too upset over the things other people do. And in fact, she was very confrontational with me this summer about something (she is a distant relative and this was about a family get together). She chewed my ass, over nothing, in an open email to the whole family. So, yes, she's a bit of a nutter, but not complete narc.
DeleteUm, I think the definition of toxic and uncaring is when a person's needs override anyone else's.
ReplyDeleteI like the rest of what this guy wrote, but it's dangerous to pretend that toxic people actually give a damn about anyone but themselves. They might "feel bad" about how others feel on occasion, but I think it's mostly because they think they out to according to normal human behavior.
I agree that thinking that just because they do something caring and nice means they won't throw us under the bus the second they get a chance is dangerous.
DeleteThanks for sharing this Jess. I'm going to tattoo it in my brain ;) xx
ReplyDeleteXX
DeleteI think I found this interesting because I do think a lot of people, including my mother and sister and even MIL, think they are being loving and caring people. I think that their definition of love is just so warped, and often trumped by their self love, that they can't TRULY love or care for someone else.
ReplyDeleteI've had a hard time just dismissing people as cruel or evil because often they are not COMPLETELY that way. And it's not always because they are manipulative and trying to con me. People are complicated and don't always fit into boxes.
What I did like about this is that even it is helpful to remind myself that even "seemingly" loving people can be so toxic that you can't be around them. That, like an alcoholic or a drug addict who adversely effects those around them, stepping away from toxic people is OK and that it is OK to take care of myself. It helps me shore up some of my commitments to self care.
"People are complicated and don't always fit into boxes." I agree. To view people in terms of all good or all bad is black and white thinking. What I like about the quote is that it brings the focus back on to us, and less on analysis of the other person. At the end of the day, if someone is having a detrimental effect on us, what they are is sort of irrelevant, we still have to take care of ourselves.
DeleteHI Jessie and Kara,
DeleteThat is what I got out of it; regardless of the degree of toxicity taking care of ourselves is important. I think there are very different levels of toxicity and it isn't black and white as you say.
Thank you for sharing this quote, it helps me remember to keep myself safe during the holidays.
Hugs, TR
I call bullshit on the whole thing, really. This part: " Some of them love us dearly. Many of them have good intentions." - "love" doesn't hurt. It doesn't NEED good intentions because LOVE is the essence of good intention.
ReplyDeleteAnd then this part: "Whether that means breaking up with someone you care about, loving a family member from a distance..." It all smacks of Political Correctness, like "well she doesn't MEAN to hurt you, don't take it PERSONALLY" forgive the perpetrator, blame the victim.
I'm not ever going to be able to "LOVE" someone from a distance who has "...force(d) us to compromise ourselves and our happiness". I've found that I c an absolutely live without HATING that person, but they are as gone to me as an ex-coworker from 1987. I think it's dangerous to mentally 'forgive' someone who hasn't acknowledged their actions and who HASN"T ASKED FOR FORGIVENESS.
For example: Some cranky old bitchy 'Aunt Clara' who always calls me fat at family parties is someone I would just never be around again. She doesn't 'love' me, and nothing she has done has created love in MY heart for her. It's a non-relationship.
That last line - You do have every right to leave and create a safer space for yourself - now THAT I can get behind. Brush them off like flies and walk towards the sun. They don't matter and aren't worth the mental gymnastics.
(says the woman who still wants to figure out what the hell went on with my dead parents - I'm an enigma wrapped in a doughy paradox.)
I hear you Gladys. And with my MIL, I could really be done with her tomorrow and that would be it. She doesn't love me, never has, and all her "loving" acts towards me are bullshit.
DeleteBut I look at someone like my little sister, someone I used to love almost as I love my own children (in fact, I often felt like she was my child). I can't say I don't love her anymore. I don't even hate her. I just clearly can't be around her because she is so extremely dysfunctional and toxic. She is abusive to me, disregards my feelings, and makes my life crazy. I have not regretted the last year of not talking to her directly ONE BIT. But that being said, I can't say that she doesn't have some semblance of love for me or vice versa. It's a complicated thing to untangle myself from.
Which is why I completely understand your desire to figure out your parents. These things haunt us.
By the way, I saw a really good "conspiracy theory" thing on TV the other day and thought of you. It was about the Denver Airport. Have you ever heard about that? It scared the begeesus out of me.
That Denver Airport is the creepiest thing! I'll try and find photos of it. It's a huge conspiracy, from (several layers of paved) basement to top...
ReplyDeleteI'm with Gladys on this. This women's gig is called The Internal Acceptance Movement. Sounds like Irritable Bowel Syndrome.
ReplyDelete